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Patman
05-10-2012, 01:27 AM
What kind of commitment? They're probably looking right now into updating their facilities. They did so when they decided to go up to division one football, there is no reason they wouldn't for hockey. Yes, I know Hockey isn't the revenue maker but obviously you don't make this kind of jump, adding full scholarships and half *** it. That would be stupid.

Maybe you don't notice the signature... I spent FIVE years at UConn... THREE of those living 50 feet from Gampel. I do not trust that UConn will invest in the required items and I worry that UConn will wobble... especially given the financial problems. I don't know if UConn has gotten through their issues but they were really having problems propping up when i was headed out. Bottom line is that I want HEA to have an out clause that's exercisable if UConn does not show continued commitment to facilities... 5K seats, etc, etc. I also believe that HCC/XL is a non-starter. Sounds nice, but its not practical. Without an out clause I think they'd be extremely foolish. On the other hand, if UConn half-asses it that's good for Lowell.

In the end, the real mistake as Notre Dame... but that's done and we'll have pains because that hasty action.

pigglegg
05-10-2012, 02:01 AM
this is the right move - for UConn and Hockey East. they should've done this years ago. it's a better move than adding Notre Dame, for the obvious geographic reasons.

pigglegg
05-10-2012, 02:15 AM
Let's all just wait until Notre Dame joins the Big 10 and gets the hell out of Hockey East. Then we'll be back to 10 teams.

Notre Dame should join Big 10 hockey. I'm really kind of surprised the league commissioner didn't have the foresight to invite them initially. Everyone's been saying it for years - Notre Dame is essentially a Big 10 team. If their football team ever broken down and joined a league (which i actually hope never happens), it would be the Big 10 and sure as hell not the Big East. Notre Dame hockey in the Big 10 makes way more sense than them trekking across the east coast to play in New England.

If Notre Dame were to leave Hockey East, the HEA should enter into serious talks with URI to get the Rams to step up their program to NCAA division 1. They've won an ACHA div 1 title and play in a rink that's not any worse than what UConn plays in now. They're a major public, state University with a strong hockey tradition at the club level. they fit the criteria. It would make total sense to have the six major New England state Universities - UConn, UMass, Vermont, UNH, Maine and URI - all in the same hockey league.

as for football and the olympic sports - UMass should join Temple in the Big East. Again, it makes total sense, and probably should have happened years ago.

Fishman'81
05-10-2012, 02:34 AM
It would probably be "addition by subtraction", yes. If it were to be done, it would be for the purposes of television.

UMA only brings Springfield with it, which is a market outside the top 100 (and made somewhat redundant being sandwiched between Boston and Hartford, DMA-wise).

IDK about that... I'd be willing to bet that UMA will travel better to CT than any other fan base.

kingdobbs
05-10-2012, 03:36 AM
IDK about that... I'd be willing to bet that UMA will travel better to CT than any other fan base.

In-person support for a team is a different thing entirely from potential support from a broader market area. In a way, they are quite orthogonal to each other; a person in the arena is, by definition, someone to whom a television network cannot advertise.

Witness the passing over of East Carolina football by the Big East in two successive expansions.

RSTuthill
05-10-2012, 06:58 AM
I think that RPI was interested but read the tea leaves correctly long ago.
Happy they will be staying in the ECAC. Another red school for us Clarkson fans to hate;);) Wouldn't be the same without them. I am sure that Union feels the same way.

(And I do have an RPI MS in ME.)

REDMEN2002
05-10-2012, 08:00 AM
It would probably be "addition by subtraction", yes. If it were to be done, it would be for the purposes of television.

This is not to say that the programs themselves are a drag competitively, but now that Hockey East has its own national TV contract with NBCSN, it will be something to consider in the future. And the "elephant in the room" problem TV wise is that Hockey East has six of its current ten in the Boston DMA. Notre Dame will add a small home market, but presence in New York and Chicago (there's no doubt in my mind Notre Dame will be trying to leverage its 'subway alumni' for hockey, which is why NBCSN is fairly interested in ND hockey in the first place), and should UConn join, they add the 'best available' DMA to the HEA portfolio (Hartford-New Haven, in the top 30; HEA's current next best is Providence-New Bedford, somewhere in the 50-55 range).

With that amount of redundancy, Hockey East could probably secure a similar contract with fewer teams. Merrimack, Northeastern and UML could probably be dropped with no significant loss to the league's presence in the Boston DMA. UMA only brings Springfield with it, which is a market outside the top 100 (and made somewhat redundant being sandwiched between Boston and Hartford, DMA-wise). Hypothetically, were those four to be "left behind" from an Eastern NCHC, the per-team revenue share for that league would probably go up even if the contract itself stayed the same.

Now, if the line holds true thus far, and college hockey does not make for a significant source of ratings (read: advertising revenue), then such a possibility would be moot; if the overall contract is ****, then it doesn't matter if the per-team share is too low, because it won't be a measurable source of revenue for the teams. But I would think the "big players" in Hockey East would be foolish not to have such a plan in their back pocket.

If you are worried about tv ratings and revenue re: college hockey, then you're fooling yourself. Look at this guy kicking out MC, UML, NU, etc. What a joke premise that is. As soon as you realize college hockey is a niche sport, the better off you'll be. Can't believe you wasted your time typing that.

Patman
05-10-2012, 09:06 AM
If you are worried about tv ratings and revenue re: college hockey, then you're fooling yourself. Look at this guy kicking out MC, UML, NU, etc. What a joke premise that is. As soon as you realize college hockey is a niche sport, the better off you'll be. Can't believe you wasted your time typing that.

Yeah, that's exactly what he was saying :rolleyes:

I am somewhat aware on BC's position with regards to Lowell's membership in HEA. I'm not in favor of it.

RSTuthill
05-10-2012, 09:11 AM
If you are worried about tv ratings and revenue re: college hockey, then you're fooling yourself. Look at this guy kicking out MC, UML, NU, etc. What a joke premise that is. As soon as you realize college hockey is a niche sport, the better off you'll be. Can't believe you wasted your time typing that.
If I were kingdobbs, I would figure out a way to walk that back somehow. Put it down to stream of consciousness idle dreaming or something.

I have learned over the years that not every thought that pops into one's head is worthy of message board publication. Maybe this is one of those learning opportunities.

Nick Papagiorgio
05-10-2012, 09:20 AM
Television markets are VERY IMPORTANT to this conversation about a sport that no one watches on tv.

VERY VERY IMPORTANT!

FlagDUDE08
05-10-2012, 09:33 AM
Television markets are VERY IMPORTANT to this conversation about a sport that no one watches on tv.

VERY VERY IMPORTANT!

Thank you, Bear Red.

Lazyking
05-10-2012, 09:53 AM
Maybe you don't notice the signature... I spent FIVE years at UConn... THREE of those living 50 feet from Gampel. I do not trust that UConn will invest in the required items and I worry that UConn will wobble... especially given the financial problems. I don't know if UConn has gotten through their issues but they were really having problems propping up when i was headed out. Bottom line is that I want HEA to have an out clause that's exercisable if UConn does not show continued commitment to facilities... 5K seats, etc, etc. I also believe that HCC/XL is a non-starter. Sounds nice, but its not practical. Without an out clause I think they'd be extremely foolish. On the other hand, if UConn half-asses it that's good for Lowell.

In the end, the real mistake as Notre Dame... but that's done and we'll have pains because that hasty action.

I'm not sure about financial side, I do know that they're maxed out on title IX and instead of adding another sport, they're just adding more scholarships for woman. They also just signed a better deal for woman's basketball and have a new AD. I agree with you that XL center shouldn't be a soloution esp considering that it's gonna cost I think 20k a game to play there but I'm not sure how long renovations/new on campus arena will take.

Bottom line is, I dont think Uconn accepts the invite if they are just gonna be happy to play in an empty xl center. That will make them look bad.

Nick Papagiorgio
05-10-2012, 09:53 AM
Thank you, Bear Red.

You're welcome, Red Cloud.

CHFAN222
05-10-2012, 09:57 AM
UCONN will join. If they had doubts about joining they wouldn't have gotten this far.

Barring any last minute freakouts similar to what happened when Villanova football tried to join Big East football this move will happen.

RSTuthill
05-10-2012, 10:16 AM
The new SNY deal for women's BB can probably fund the HE admission all by itself. Agree this is going to happen. They are just into the details which all have to get laid flat before going forward.

sterlippo1
05-10-2012, 10:19 AM
I am somewhat aware on BC's position with regards to Lowell's membership in HEA.

which is?

Jim
05-10-2012, 10:46 AM
I'm not sure about financial side, I do know that they're maxed out on title IX and instead of adding another sport, they're just adding more scholarships for woman. They also just signed a better deal for woman's basketball and have a new AD. I agree with you that XL center shouldn't be a soloution esp considering that it's gonna cost I think 20k a game to play there but I'm not sure how long renovations/new on campus arena will take.

Bottom line is, I dont think Uconn accepts the invite if they are just gonna be happy to play in an empty xl center. That will make them look bad.UCONN will join. Word on the street, so to speak, is that Freitas will be expanded in the next 5 years (and UCONN probably doesn't join until 2014-15 season, a year after Notre Dame, so there is ample time to begin a fairly modest fundraising effort ($10-11 Million compared to $35m for basketball and $50m for football). it is unofficial, but the plan I am told is of a projected 17 game home schedule, UConn will play 5-7 games,all or mostly non-conference, on campus and 10-12 including its Hockey East contests, at the XL Center until the upgraded arena is ready. Once that is available, the balance will shift, with some Hartford games each season, most likely the biggest games (BC, BU, a major power like Minnesota or Michgan are likely Hartford games for example). I was told that's the plan. there are also discussions about a slightly smaller arena since Freitas can be expanded to close to 4000 reasonably. 5000 is much more complicated. Given that Merrimack, Providence, Vermont, and Northeastern are all less than 5000, and with the Civic Center available if necessary, that isn't going ot be a huge issue.

Vooter
05-10-2012, 10:48 AM
I also believe that HCC/XL is a non-starter. Sounds nice, but its not practical.

Why? UConn plays football in Hartford, and the XL folks have expressed nothing but enthusiasm for the idea...

BU2K
05-10-2012, 11:18 AM
Once that is available, the balance will shift, with some Hartford games each season, most likely the biggest games (BC, BU, a major power like Minnesota or Michgan are likely Hartford games for example).

I am sure Minnesota and Michigan already have penciled in the trip... :rolleyes:

MUhawks628
05-10-2012, 11:47 AM
Notre Dame should join Big 10 hockey. I'm really kind of surprised the league commissioner didn't have the foresight to invite them initially.

The Big 10 does not accept partial membership.